New To SCD

[Opticks]

I started SCD/4hb on 5/6/2012 and wanted to talk about some sticking points I have . . .

On 3/20 of this year I started to exercise a lot, doing HIIT / KettleBell Swings, pushups, and some other home stuff a few days a week. I was on my own prescribed diet of no junk food, high protein / low fat foods (chicken salad, turkey sandwiches both on wheat), power bars, protein shakes, yogurt, etc. - until I found 4hb.

I made some progress, and have progress pics of my development since March.

I started PAGG on the 6th, but I was taking a lower dose than recommended, so that didn't do anything, and I thought that the damage control exercises were immediately before and 90 mins after each meal - so I did those like that for a week and a half.

Apparently I read somewhere that carrots were OK, and have been eating piles of those with each meal. Only to find out today that they are full of sugar. FML.

On top of that, I have some ear pain, so I stopped the PAGG in anticipation of getting an antibotic when I visit the doctor this week, and will resume the PAGG once I finish it.

I got some 0carb/0sugar whey isolate for diabetics that I plan to start taking for my 30in30 when I wake up. I know that whey is frowned upon, but I don't see how Tim recommends it in the book, and it worked for his dad if it is so bad. I plan on doing that at 6:30 in the AM, and then having a normal cooked breakfast about 2 hours later or so, and then 4 hour meals after that.

I would like to start doing HIIT again twice a week for 30 mins, and then just stick with the meals and stuff. No shake or anything, just workout right before lunch or something, then make food and eat.

My main food has been eggs, turkey bacon, green beans, black/white beans, grass-fed beef that I make into 2x 1/4 lb burgers, and grilled chicken. I have very very few almonds if I am running low on energy or something.

Can you guys help me spot check anymore? I have some current flex / no_flex pics if you want. I am not really worried about my weight, but losing some inches off of my lower abs would be much appreciated, and that is my main goal - even if it takes 6+ months to get there. Ideally I would like to have a 6pack by this time next year, if that is at all possible. I am willing to stick with this for the long term, and I think that a saturday cheat day will help achieve that, even if I can't go hog wild.

Any/all help is GREATLY appreciated!

[justhamade]

and I thought that the damage control exercises were immediately before and 90 mins after each meal - so I did those like that for a week and a half.

The damage control before you biggest meal of the day, everyday, is what I recommend, worked very well for me.

Apparently I read somewhere that carrots were OK, and have been eating piles of those with each meal. Only to find out today that they are full of sugar. FML.

Carrots are actually a pretty good carbs source. I wouldn't go over board on them but great for post workout.

On top of that, I have some ear pain, so I stopped the PAGG in anticipation of getting an antibotic when I visit the doctor this week, and will resume the PAGG once I finish it.

Antibiotics should be an extreme circumstance. They are bad for you gut bacteria, therefore really bad for health and fat loss. http://chriskresser.com/the-high-price- ... ly-recover
and
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/the-prob ... z1lzxZki3H

I got some 0carb/0sugar whey isolate for diabetics that I plan to start taking for my 30in30 when I wake up. I know that whey is frowned upon, but I don't see how Tim recommends it in the book, and it worked for his dad if it is so bad. I plan on doing that at 6:30 in the AM, and then having a normal cooked breakfast about 2 hours later or so, and then 4 hour meals after that.

I would avoid protein with sucralose. I use Now Foods Protein they use stevia

I am not really worried about my weight, but losing some inches off of my lower abs would be much appreciated, and that is my main goal - even if it takes 6+ months to get there.

Defintely harder when you don't have much to loose. I would mix up heavy lifting 1-2 times a week with HIIT 1-2 times a week, would probably get more benefit.

Good Luck

[Opticks]

Thanks for the reply, I will start to add HIIT and some lifting (I don't have a gym membership, but I do other stuff) into my routine!

The whey I got has NO SUCRALOSE and NO SUGAR of any kind! That is why I got it . . .

http://www.shopabouttime.com/Whey_Prote ... s_s/28.htm

^ this is it, I think it's similar to that stuff you recommended. I got the unflavored, but the flavored versions use that stevia.

EDIT: No ear infection or trouble at all, so I'll be back on PAGG for the weekend and cheat day!

Also, when I start back with HIIT/Lifting, both will be 30 mins combined, when is the best time to do that - since I won't be doing a post-workout shake or anything?

I do a shake at 6-7 AM for my 30in30 (1.5 scoops = 37g protein, I add some decaf instant coffee for taste), then lay around for a bit until 10 or so and then have 3 normal meals, each ~4 hours apart. So would immediately before my first "real" breakfast be the best? I only plan on doing this 2 days a week.

ALSO: Is the new night regiment for the PAGG to take PAG (omit green tea pill)?

justhamade: I read your blog and it is amazing! Can you recommend some gluten free foods to eat on cheat day? I was going to do doughnuts, but I don't think anywhere offers the gluten free kind. I was going to do candy, ice cream, soda, cookies, and chocolate, but was looking for some high carb / high calorie stuff . . .

[johnshade]

Opticks,

Welcome to the site. As you get lower and lower in BF% you need to tweak things a bit and you also need to be more patient.

Justin has you pretty well covered here on the diet. I would add:

1. DO NOT eat low fat anything. Banish the low fat myth from you mind. If a product says low/reduced fat..then don't buy it. You need fat for recovery and to lose weight. Period.

2. Don't overdo the HIIT. I would do heavy lifting/barbell work three days a week. Focus on compound lifts like Squats/deadlifts/press...don't overcomplicate it. Something like starting strength or wendlers 5-3-1 is perfect. Add in some basic bodyweight stuff like pushups, pullups and dips and then do your two days of metabolic HIIT. 30 minutes is a long time. I would say go harder, heavier and shorter.

3. eat most of your carbs right after/during the workout.

4. Make your cheat days gluten free and more like half cheat days. Mine are usually one big meal on saturday night.

5. look into intermittent fasting...it works.

Good luck.

[Opticks]

Opticks,

Welcome to the site. As you get lower and lower in BF% you need to tweak things a bit and you also need to be more patient.

Justin has you pretty well covered here on the diet. I would add:

1. DO NOT eat low fat anything. Banish the low fat myth from you mind. If a product says low/reduced fat..then don't buy it. You need fat for recovery and to lose weight. Period.

2. Don't overdo the HIIT. I would do heavy lifting/barbell work three days a week. Focus on compound lifts like Squats/deadlifts/press...don't overcomplicate it. Something like starting strength or wendlers 5-3-1 is perfect. Add in some basic bodyweight stuff like pushups, pullups and dips and then do your two days of metabolic HIIT. 30 minutes is a long time. I would say go harder, heavier and shorter.

3. eat most of your carbs right after/during the workout.

4. Make your cheat days gluten free and more like half cheat days. Mine are usually one big meal on saturday night.

5. look into intermittent fasting...it works.

Good luck.

THANKS!

I am not expecting results tomorrow, I am looking for them a year from tomorrow. One thing I am impatient about is making sure that I remove as many things that I am doing incorrectly as possible, or things that will hinder my progress, because they will add up over time and be a great disservice to my hard work and patience. One example of this is the benefit of switching to gluten-free cheat days.

in response:

1) I haven't touched this stuff since I started SCD on 5/6. I don't know where the idea came from that I was still doing this, I didn't state anything about it specifically. I only eat 1/2 plate of protein, 1/4 plate legumes, 1/4 plate veggies as per the 4HB book for every meal other than my 30in30 7am shake. My other 3 meals of the day are all real food with the previously listed portions.

2) I don't have a gym membership or a pull up bar. My options are: Kettlebell swings (home made), I have a curling bar, and that is about it. My HIIT plan was to do Kettlebell swings, burpees aka squat thrusts, and pushups in countdown form: 15x,14x,13x,12x,11x,10x. Those numbers when added total 75 - the magic number Time prescribed in the book. I was going to rest a bit in between sets.

Should I change this and do other stuff? What do you recommend?

I don't even have a bench to do presses on, or dumbbells. So any heavy lifting is out if it isn't done via body weight.

My only option is pushups, kettlebells, that curling bar, or other body weight work outs.

3) I don't know what most of my carbs are. I only eat chicken or beef, some beans, and veggies. I think I would be starving if I didn't have beans with my meals, and I thought the purpose of SCD was to not be hurngry between meals.

4) Cheat days will start being gluten free. Do you have a recommendation list of cheat foods to eat? I read an article talking about needing to make it ~8 hrs to replace the leptin. And that it should be high in carbs/fat/calories.

I am very open to suggestions.

http://www.topfatlosstrainer.com/2009/1 ... -fat-loss/

"And remember, a cheat 'meal' does nothing to accomplish the boost in leptin we’re looking for… this has to be maintained for at least 8 hours, hence a cheat 'day.'"

5) Do you have more info on the fasting? Justin recommends all of Sunday after cheat day, since one's metabolism will be in overdrive.

If you laid out a fasting plan for me: "fast between these meals on such and such day, or do this" - I would follow it to the letter. Otherwise I'm going to google around and follow whatever I read on a random blog . . . any names of the trade, etc. would be helpful!

Thanks again for the reply!

I am very ready to work hard.

[justhamade]

Also, when I start back with HIIT/Lifting, both will be 30 mins combined, when is the best time to do that - since I won't be doing a post-workout shake or anything?

Exercise before biggest meal of the day. Think about it like you need to work for your food, and you food is fuel.

justhamade: I read your blog and it is amazing! Can you recommend some gluten free foods to eat on cheat day? I was going to do doughnuts, but I don't think anywhere offers the gluten free kind. I was going to do candy, ice cream, soda, cookies, and chocolate, but was looking for some high carb / high calorie stuff . . .

Thanks, I haven't has as much time as lately to post. I try to do 'paleo' style desserts usually. A LOT of fruit, coconut mik, stuff like that. My wife makes awesome coconut flour pancakes. I eat a lot of dark chocolate. Dried mangos, stuff like that.

[johnshade]

I will respond more later but in the meantime check this out.

http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting

[Opticks]

I will respond more later but in the meantime check this out.

http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting

perfect, thank you!

EDIT: do you have to do these fasting supplements for amino acids and the greens drink stuff? i really don't have any more money to be dumping on supplements after PAGG and my now 30in30 protein for morning shakes.

Does one take PAGG while fasting as well? I'm guessing no . . .

He goes on to say: "The tea, greens, and BCAAs aren’t essential to fasting, but in our experience, they make it a lot easier."

I will def do green tea and stuff. I am not sure if drinking 32 oz of tea during the fast is acceptable. I don't see how liquids like water and green tea could be bad.

[johnshade]

I don't do any of that green drink stuff. I do utilize BCAAs before my workouts. Those are cheap. I have never done PAGG myself so I'm not qualified to speak to it's effectiveness.

My suggestion is to not overthink it. Just understand that for about a week and half you're going to experience some psychological cravings b/c you've been programmed to eat morning, noon and night, plus snacks. Truthfully, the most helpful things about IF are not even the fat loss(though it works for that)but rather the liberation from thinking about food all day long. I almost NEVER eat before 1pm...when I do, I don't beat myself up. I also never eat carbs early in the day. I find that it just slows me down.

You will also find that IF creates an strange, and well reported, mental clarity that can be rewarding as well.

In short, mess around with it. Eat SCD and try IF. I personally utilize both. Saturday night I had a huge workout in the early evening, then went out and ate pasta and bread at a restaurant. Then I fasted to the following evening without a problem and workout the next afternoon, taking BCAAs only.

i would also add the caveat that Justin mentioned that IF is NOT for everyone. No diet is. But try it and see what your response is too it.

[Opticks]

I don't do any of that green drink stuff. I do utilize BCAAs before my workouts. Those are cheap. I have never done PAGG myself so I'm not qualified to speak to it's effectiveness.

My suggestion is to not overthink it. Just understand that for about a week and half you're going to experience some psychological cravings b/c you've been programmed to eat morning, noon and night, plus snacks. Truthfully, the most helpful things about IF are not even the fat loss(though it works for that)but rather the liberation from thinking about food all day long. I almost NEVER eat before 1pm...when I do, I don't beat myself up. I also never eat carbs early in the day. I find that it just slows me down.

You will also find that IF creates an strange, and well reported, mental clarity that can be rewarding as well.

In short, mess around with it. Eat SCD and try IF. I personally utilize both. Saturday night I had a huge workout in the early evening, then went out and ate pasta and bread at a restaurant. Then I fasted to the following evening without a problem and workout the next afternoon, taking BCAAs only.

i would also add the caveat that Justin mentioned that IF is NOT for everyone. No diet is. But try it and see what your response is too it.

Thanks again for the reply! I successfully completed my first 24h fast from 10-10 last night - it was pretty easy. I really enjoyed the extra time created by not being tied down by food prep and cooking like I am throughout the week. It was really nice to relax and read a book all day.

I already feel the mental clarity, and like it. Hunger doesn't scare me anymore, or generate a reaction. The only problem that I have with this is that with SCD/4HB I thought one was to never be hungry throughout the day? Also with the talk about fasting at leangains, the guy recommends skipping breakfast, which is something that SCD/4HB completely prohibits.

I still do my unflavored/no_sugar whey shake for my 30in30 breakfast, but I am not sure if I should be eating 4 meals a day. I do my shake at 6/7, and then a regular breakfast / early lunch at 10:30/11, and then a lunch/dinner thing at like 4 or so. Usually after this it is 8 PM, and I could eat, but I really don't want to. Is this something I should force myself to do with a few hard boiled eggs or something?

Also, I see some people recommending the 24hr fast 1-2x a week. Once on Sunday (post cheat day), and once in the middle of the week. 24hr fasting is no trouble for me, but I wanted to know if it would be too ambitious for me at this point in the game: non-last mile, etc.